Mike Peterson: We don't want to sit back and, uh, be idle and essentially atrophy, you know, learning takes conscious effort, and it's really important to, to make sure that's embraced in your own personal story with whatever you're doing. There's always opportunities to grow. And that ties in really nicely to my third lesson, which I heard from an old mentor of mine, Dan Mayer, back at BioMarin.

Dan, uh, is now retired. Uh, he was the head of, um, uh, Product Management, Portfolio Development. One of, one of those two titles at, at BioMarin when I joined. And I think he's one of the, uh, not necessarily a founder, but he was one of the first kind of people. 10 to 20 employees. So I, I worked very closely with him and, um, he said very early on in my career, which I'm very grateful for that you need to ride the wave.

And so you can think of this wave in your career. As you step onto the wave, you're at the bottom and you start learning and building skills and the wave starts to crest and you're at the peak of the wave. And at some point, That wave is going to crash and smooth out over the sand on the beach. And you want to make sure that by the time the wave you're on peaks, you step off to the next wave and ride that wave even higher.

And, uh, and I've been living my entire career based on that advice. You know, when I, when I feel like I'm not learning something, I take a step laterally and ride the next wave to teach myself something new. And it's been, uh, a really powerful experience.

Joe Miller: Hey, Mike Peterson. Welcome to Titans of Transition.

Thanks for having me, Joe. Hey, Mike. I'm really pleased to have you. We've gotten to know each other in our technology leadership group, our CIL group. And as we talked before and after meetings, I thought it was really interesting some of the transitions you have gone through. And the latest thing that came up, you're writing your fourth book and it just, it pushed it over the top.

I figured I'd ask you if you'd be on the show and you agreed to do so. So thank you. Yeah, thanks for having me, Joe. I'm excited to be here. Let's start off and talk about your high level arc of the different things you have done and how, how you've gone through your career and then we'll dig into some of the more notable transitions.

As you know, this podcast is really focused on. Seeing those transitions one goes through in their career, in their life, and trying to understand what prompts a change, how that change becomes clear to a person, and then we try to unpack lessons learned. Hopefully they've been a benefit to everyone, so we'll just keep that in mind and kind of sprinkle those things in as we go along.

Mike Peterson: Yeah, that sounds, that sounds great. I have a relatively unusual background, I think, for people in the HR space. I have been the head of HR at two public biotech companies, as well as the head of IT at those same biotech companies. So it's a kind of an unusual role to see HR and IT under the same roof. If we start at the beginning, during college, I did computer repair for Best Buy and the Geek Squad.

So I have I have a tech support in, in my DNA, um, had the, uh, the clip on tie and everything. It was, uh, it was a lot of fun. And my first, uh, real career, so to speak was, uh, actually as a wildland firefighter. So I was based in, uh, Davis, California. And all the way around the Western United States fighting forest fires and type two hand crews contracted by the U.

S. Forest Service. I did that for three years and kind of worked my way up the chain. And my last year I led a crew of 22 firefighters. And I loved it. It was really one of the most fun jobs I've ever had. It was super dangerous. You know, I was a young guy and, and just seeing all of the, kind of the older folks had been doing this their whole lives die around me.

A couple died from lung cancer, a couple died from a helicopter crash and a squad got burned over in one of the last fires that I, that I worked and quite a few people died. And so it, it really just hit too close to home. And I am, uh, personally an adrenaline junkie and a thrill seeker, and I love extreme sports, but I couldn't.

Kind of handle the weight of other people's lives in my hands. I could make a decision that could cost people their lives, and I didn't like that. So, Um, I decided to go back to my network and reached out to two of my network and two of my firefighting colleagues had moved on to a company called BioMarin.

And, uh, I was living in Colorado at the time, but oddly enough, BioMarin was less than a mile away from my dad's house. And so I asked my dad, you know, who's, who's this company BioMarin? And he said, it's a, it's a really great company. They're up and coming. They're doing some really cool stuff. You should.

Explore it. And I have a degree in health and exercise science, and at the time thought I wanted to go into clinical operations, helping, kind of helping, um, uh, more directly patients, and I used my network to, to meet the HR team and had a conversation, told them my story. They called me up a few weeks later, and they said, We have a role for you.

We're not sure you're going to like it, but it's, uh, it's filing papers for the HR department. And at the time, I really didn't have any real appreciation for even what HR was. You know, I was in my early twenties, uh, with my only real experience being firefighting and, and the geek squad. And, um, And I said, what the heck, I'll, I'll take it.

And, uh, I moved from Colorado to California and picked up my kind of temporary gig doing filing for the HR department at BioMarin. I, um, I had the, that kind of amazing opportunity to grow, to, to join at BioMarin at 600 employees and stayed until it was 3000. And in that growth, you really kind of went out there and started, um, kind of applying for new positions as they opened up and, um, used a lot of my technology experience to, to grow my career at BioMarin.

So I, uh, used a lot of that Geek Squad expertise to take BioMarin's kind of antiquated paper process and build, uh, build process, uh, in applications. So build, building simple things like e forms and SharePoint. to implement applicant tracking systems to, to really automate and streamline processes. And I had a really great relationship with both the head of HR when I started, his name was Mark Wood, and I'm still very close with Mark Wood, and the head of HR when I left, named Rich Ranieri.

And so over the course of my eight years at BiomRIN, I had eight different jobs and eight different bosses, so I really had an amazing opportunity to do a lot of stuff as the company really exploded, both with number of employees, but also number of countries. So during that time, I also had the opportunity to practice HR in 17 different countries, um, uh, helped with, uh, an acquisition in the Netherlands.

I spent a lot of time in Ireland and London. I did an interim role as the interim head of HR for Asia Pacific, living in Hong Kong, supporting Australia, Japan, Malaysia. 

Joe Miller: I just have to interject because it just reminds me of those old, from stock boy to president kind of stories, which tells me a little bit about you as a person, not just, you know, on the surface you might just conclude you have a lot of drive, but I would say you probably were willing to do Lots of different things.

And when there was an opportunity, you weren't too risk adverse. Getting back to being a risk taker on the physical sense, you're also a risk taker in your career. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yeah. When, when opportunities came up to, to essentially learn something, learn a new skill set, learn a new function. Learn a new role. I jumped for it.

I, I didn't, uh, I didn't say no when an opportunity came up. I just went ahead and said, yeah, I'll do it and I'll try my best. 

Joe Miller: And so by the time you left, what level position were you in or what was your role? You said you had some interim roles actually running HR. Yeah. Yeah. 

Mike Peterson: So my, my title was only a senior manager.

At the time. So I had, I went from file clerk to senior manager in, in eight years. And I remember when I, when I left Byamarin, I spoke to one of the executive team members and told him my decision to leave. And he said, you know, you know, Mike, I don't, I don't blame you for leaving. It's really hard for a boy to become a man under his mother's roof.

Meaning that if, if you grow up in a company, it's hard for people to see you as something different than, than that file clerk that you started at. So even though I was doing. A role bigger than many directors in BioMarin, I was, I was kind of being held back at that senior manager level, which is one of the reasons I was motivated to move on.

Joe Miller: Right out the gate, taking risks, not being afraid to step in and meet the call, so to speak, and then having a sense of timing. One to lead. Did you feel as though it just, you became aware that there really wasn't any more opportunity to above you? I mean, how did it come to you that it was time for making a transition from BioMarin, which is a great company.

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Um, yeah, It really is. And I, I enjoyed every moment of my time at BioMarin and I'm super grateful for all of the opportunity and that I had and all of the people that I worked with, um, once we hit that 3000 employee mark, I, I have a distinct memory, uh, in my head that has stuck with me, um, of walking down the halls and, and going through the cafeteria and just thinking, you know, gosh, I don't, I don't know any of these people.

You know, I, when I started at BioMarin at 600 employees, I knew everyone, you know, being in HR, you're in a very social role active in all hands meetings and events. And, and so I knew everyone and I started to feel less like I was able to make a personal impact at BioMarin and more kind of like a cog in the machine.

There was really nothing against my time at BioMarin. It was more about the company was evolving, um, to its, its next phase of its evolution, right? It's, it was becoming, um, midsize to larger pharmaceutical company based on the success it was, it was having with its, uh, with its product. 

Joe Miller: And so was there a specific nudge or did you start looking for your next?

Mike Peterson: I didn't have a specific nudge that was like a, an immediate catalyst, but I, Um, I knew I had something good at BioMarin, so I wasn't, I wasn't willing to let that go for anything. You know, I kind of quietly let people in my network know I was open to something new and, um, nothing really came of it for six or so months.

Um, I think maybe I did like one or two phone interviews in six months, uh, cause I really wanted to, to target a, like a two to 300 biotech company, one product already on the market. To avoid some of that risk, because there's, in the pharmaceutical industry, there's a lot of startups that either have bad data and, and they, they fail, or they get acquired, and I didn't want to jump ship just to be looking for another job six months later.

Zogenix ended up, did end up finding me, and they were kind of an interesting company. They were 60 employees. with no products on the market. They had just filed an NDA for a drug that had gone through phase three clinical trials, and they were very much like a startup, but they were at time, I think, uh, something like 12 years old.

So they had had products approved in the past that they then sold and moved their headquarters from San Diego up to the Bay area. And so they, it was a little bit of a hybrid that made me feel a little bit more comfortable with the risk. And so it was a, it was a startup, but they had kind of process that had been around for 10 years and they had some really promising products in the pipeline.

And so I joined Zogenix as the head of HR at a 60 person company out of Emeryville. And so again, a big leap of faith going from senior manager level HR person that had arguably done a lot, but really taking a very big step in, in my career to really grow into that head of HR role. 

Joe Miller: Yeah, that's, uh, it's interesting.

There's so many crossovers here and I don't know if this would interest anyone, but it's a small world in this industry. Yeah. You know, as you were talking about Biomer and there's about three or four people that I. That I knew there, that were there when you were there and still there, some of them, some of them retired.

Uh, and then when you went to, uh, the company in Emeryville, that was just down the street from another company that I spent 11 years at, and I remember having a conversation with you not too long after you moved into that role. And in that last role that I had in Berkeley, just down the, down the road from you, I reported it in to the VP of HR.

Mike Peterson: Wow, I forgot that. 

Joe Miller: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that, that's kind of curious. And some of the people from XOMA went to BioMarin. So we know some of the same people. So that's, that's a huge shift people. Now you've gone to a company. What was it? A couple hundred? 60 employees. 60. So a smaller, so ground floor. And I've been in this position too.

We have a title and you have a responsibility, but it's a very hands on kind of situation with 60 people. You might have been partially geek squatting 

it again.

Mike Peterson: Exactly. So I think when I joined, there was one, I inherited one person in HR, uh, and I reported to a chief of staff who, who managed, uh, HR, legal, corporate communications, uh, compliance.

Yeah, more like a, uh, chief, uh, administrative officer. Um, a month or two after I joined the, the HR rep ended up leaving and moving down to LA. So it was, it was just me. So it was really hands on and, uh, and I had the opportunity to, to rebuild an HR department from scratch. So the, the company being 12 years old at the time, everything was paper based and the, the IT department was outsourced to a small mom and shop, mom and pop shop in Emeryville.

And, um, my plan was really to leverage technology and hire around that technology. So I wanted to, for example, build an HRIS and then hire someone to manage that HRIS and then automate org charts and hire someone to manage those org charts and really leverage automation. And so I, I, went to the HR, or sorry, the IT team and said, you know, I, I have this, this vision for implementing a lot of technology.

What do I do? What's the process? And they just said, you know, Do whatever you want, have at it. Let us, let us know if you have any questions. And I was like, look, this is cool. You know, at BioMarin, we had, you know, project intake forms and budget forms and you know, a very mature, very mature regimented process that had multiple layers of both within the department and Uh, and then IT approvals and sometimes program approvals.

And so it was very refreshing. And so in a year we had the entire HR function paperless. We had implemented, you know, core HRIS, automated org charts, performance management system, an applicant tracking system with digital interviews and feedback forms. We had a compensation platform. You know, we had, we had the full suite of systems in there.

And my boss, Susan Hannon. Who is, uh, has been a tremendous partner to me in my career, said, you know what, like, this is so cool, what you've done with HR, like, what do you think about doing this for the rest of the company? You know, what do you think about taking over IT? And I was like, wow. That is such a cool idea.

Like I would love that.

Joe Miller: Once again, you're not looking at any of the potential downsides of being responsible for IT. You're just jumping into the fray and saying, here's what I can do and I'm ready to go. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yeah. And so right, right after that is when I think you and I really started working closer together.

And, you know, I was, uh, kind of a wide eyed, bushy tailed, new kid on the block saying, you know, there's, there's so much to do. Where do I start? What do I do? How do I do it? But it was a really neat experience. Cool. 

Joe Miller: So one thing we're going to end up landing with, with your fourth book. So if at any point in time, as we go through this discussion of your transitions, you start to remember that sort of a, there was something in the back of your mind saying, I think I want to write some things.

Let me know when that appears. Okay. So I just want to tease ahead a little bit for those who might be joining this episode, looking for that transition in particular. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, and that really starts at the acquisition of Zogenix. So we're not really far off there. Not too far. 

Joe Miller: Okay. 

Mike Peterson: So at, um, after, after Susan had asked me to, to take over leadership of IT, Zogenix went through its own boom of success at a slightly smaller scale than BioMarin, but we grew to just under 500 employees.

We got two product, products approved, commercialized in the U. S. and in Europe and Japan. Had a really awesome product for Dravet syndrome, a really, uh, catastrophic form of rare epilepsy, and it was that success, that that triggered UCB, a much larger Belgian pharmaceutical company to, to acquire Sogenic.

So UCB is, is really focused on, on epilepsy products. So we kind of fit in nicely with their, their product portfolio. So we, we went from really kind of full steam ahead. We're, we're building this amazing portfolio to, you know, hold on, there's a offer on the table that's too good to turn away.

Shareholders want us to bite on it and really shift gears. So, so we got acquired. in my fifth year at Zogenix for, for just under 2 billion. And that was really one of the biggest transitions of my life that we can, we can kind of use to shift the gears towards, towards writing. Uh, at the end at Zogenix was managing about 90 projects between both departments, both HR and IT departments.

So we, we were, we were cooking, we were full steam ahead, moving at 150 miles per hour. And UCP came in and just said, pause everything. We don't care what it is, pause everything. And we're going to take a look at what we can do. We just want you to be available for, for questions. You know, we, we like your team, but if you want a full time job, you're going to have to relocate to Atlanta.

And, uh, kind of, we'll, we'll be in touch if we need anything. So it was a, it was a very abrupt stop. And, uh, At the time being that kind of adrenaline junkie, I really wanted to, to kind of keep my momentum, right? I was, I was moving so fast and my kind of 60 hour a week job working nights and weekends became like a 20 hour per week job, you know, don't tell anyone I said that, but it was, it was, 

Joe Miller: uh, do you want me to cut that part out?

Mike Peterson: That's okay. It was a big transition. I think, I think it's fairly common in, in acquisitions for those kinds of things to happen because the acquiring company has a lot. Of work to do on their end to see, okay, what, what are the things we want to catch? And what are the things we want to let fall? And so I, I wanted to effectively like invest my time because I knew I was going back into an in house role.

I knew that I was going to be busy again because I have this tendency to invest my entire life into whatever company I'm working for. And so I got kind of obsessed with this concept of passive income. You know, what, what can I do with my time now that can generate money 20 years from now without me having to do anything?

Um, I. I didn't really have many friends who had done that, or, or past colleagues, so it was, it was a lot of internet research, and reading books, and watching YouTube videos, and I landed on, on three, three ideas. Invent something. I have a couple of ideas percolating in my head over my lifetime of, of things to invent.

Make a board game. Both my girlfriend and I are super avid board game players, and I actually have a family friend who made a card game like 30 years ago, and he's still getting royalty checks. Um, and write a book. And very quickly, the first two seemed a little bit intimidating. You know, it's, it's kind of expensive and you need lawyers to, to file patents to invent something.

And my ideas, while they're cool, I'm not, I wasn't sure that they really had potential. Making a board game also required quite a bit of investment for prototyping and physical materials, um, and you have to do play testing and all that kind of stuff. And so I, I kind of landed on writing a book. I wanted it to be something I was passionate about.

And I knew, I knew if it became kind of a burden, so to speak, that I, I would let it kind of languish. And if things got busy again, I wouldn't pick up the baton.

I decided to write a book about my dog, Choco. Choco was my fur baby. He unfortunately passed away earlier this year, in March, but He was, uh, he was such a great dog. I got him when he was a seven week old puppy and he was the kind of dog that never needed a leash, like wherever you were, he was, and he had a ton of emotion and could understand verbal cues and hand signals and kind of just like head nods.

So he was a, he was a really, really great companion. What kind of a dog? He was a miniature Australian Shepherd. Yeah. And so thinking about the kind of books I could write, it seemed fairly obvious that I wasn't going to write a scientific book about Australian shepherds. Science fiction story. Yeah. And, um, and the idea came to me to write a children's book and it's easier to write.

It's a shorter project, right? I didn't know if I was going to be, Kind of on standby for two months, six months or a year or two years, whatever that might be. So I, I liked the children's book idea because it was easier to get off the ground. And that's what really solidified that idea in my head that I'm, I'm going to use my time right now to write a children's book.

And theoretically, once I publish that book, I never need to touch it ever again. And if someone buys that book, 50 years from now, when I'm 90 years old, I will still get a royalty. It's really interesting. 

Joe Miller: So you came to the determination of what you were going to write. It came out of the subject matter coming out of your love for your pooch, but what was going to be in the book was, is a whole other map.

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yeah. And my passion for, for HR kind of shined through there then. So it was now I'm going to write a children's book about my dog, Chaco, and I'm going to weave in. Life lessons and HR concepts, leadership, leadership lessons. And that's going to be the theme of this series of books. If I choose to make it a series, cause that at the time, it was just really more of a one and done idea.

I, you know, I didn't realize that I was going to enjoy the process so much and that it was so much fun. 

Joe Miller: So I was interested actually in following up and asking you, uh, going beyond this, these, you know, lessons, and it was going to be a one and done. You know, these HR lessons embedded into the book, which I think is great idea on leadership lessons as well.

But did you think it was a one and done because you had a certain block of time in your mind that you knew you would be sort of? Available and then you'd be jumping back into another full-time role. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, exactly. And 

Joe Miller: back to 60 hours a week again, was that kind of what you were thinking at the time?

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yeah. So I think you hit the nail on the head and there were really two considerations. I think one was the full-time role I, I. I had full expectations to go back into a full time role for the rest of my career. Uh, I'm in a full time role, I barely have time to do laundry, let alone write more books.

Uh, and the second thing was, um, you know, a part of me wanted to write, uh, the first Chaco book, Chaco's First Day at Work, as, as a, uh, a way to kind of immortalize, uh, Chaco. He was, uh, 14 at the time. So he was, he was getting older and it was, it was kind of my, my, uh, way to kind of pay homage to our relationship and his companionship over the years.

So, I, I did not, uh, think in my wildest dreams it would actually turn into, to a series. 

Joe Miller: Well, I'm just going to take the opportunity to swing back here and let my dog in because she was whining. 

Mike Peterson: I know exactly how that is. Closed doors can be very troubling for, for dogs. Exactly. 

Joe Miller: So what happened next? I mean, did you in fact find another role or did you just decide that That was an offer.

Mike Peterson: Yeah, yeah. So I, I did find another role. Um, and it was, it was surprisingly perfect timing. UCB at some point gave me. Uh, a six month clock and said, we want you to stay on for, for six more months. And then after that, we're going to let you go very similar to my last transition. Uh, this company structure therapeutics found me through, uh, through a recruiter that's in my network structure therapeutics was, was almost a, Uh, kind of a repeat of Zogenix.

So they were a 60 person company. They were, uh, albeit much earlier in the clinical development life cycle. They had just received, I believe, phase one data and we're going into phase two clinical trials, but they have really, really cool science. So they're working on making, uh, oral, GLP 1. So, you know, if you think about Wegovy or Semaglutatide, Ozempic.

Yeah, those are all injectables and they're working on essentially a pill form that could be used potentially for weight loss or potentially for diabetes treatment as well. So very, very cool stuff. The, the other really exciting piece about joining Structure was they offered me a role to be the head of HR and the head of IT again.

So it was an opportunity to continue my passion for, for technology. Yeah. So it was, it was really exciting. The company is headquartered in South San Francisco. So it's a, a U S company, but we went through an IPO during my time at Structure. So it was super, super exciting doing the, kind of the, the NASDAQ experience.

But it has a very unique business model for, for Bay Area biotech companies, although I think it's getting more popular now, but, but two, three years ago, it was very, very unique that everything preclinical and earlier, so everything before it touches humans is done in China. So about two thirds of the employees were in China.

Everything from, uh, you know, drug discovery to toxicology, early research, was all done in China. So, it was a good fit. It seemed like a good fit at the time because of my experience in Hong Kong and supporting China at BioMarin and Japan with Zogenix. But I didn't think about the time difference. So, I was often working a swing shift, uh, to overlap, you know, 5 p.

m. Pacific time is 8 a. m. the following day in Shanghai. Uh, So I was working late nights, and my girlfriend works a lot with Europe, so she's doing the opposite, and she's working early mornings, and, um, so we just never saw each other, and it really strained the relationship, and, uh, and it was like we were, you know, just passing in the wind.

About a year into my time at Berkshire, I had a very big transition that was, that was unplanned, and I ate a chicken sandwich from Costco and got salmonella. And I remember this. Yeah, not only did I get extreme food poisoning, I guess I was one of the below 1 percent of people that have a cardiac event due to Salmonella.

So, we went to the hospital, I was in the hospital for 5 days, and essentially had a heart attack that was not normal. caused by an internal blocked artery. So my heart, the doctors think my heart got swollen and kind of pinched itself off. So it wasn't able to pump blood thoroughly. So I had what they called a non stemmy myocardial infarction due to myocarditis.

Joe Miller: So the infection went into your heart muscle. Yeah. And that caused some occlusion or some blockage in flow. Yeah, that's wild. 

Mike Peterson: Exactly, yeah. So it was, it was really scary, you know, and, and it was a kind of a five day experience of doctors just saying like, you know, we, you're dying right now, but we don't know why.

And it was something out of like the show House, you know, or Grey's Anatomy. And it's like, you know, you seem fine. You're able to have a conversation, but your blood work is literally telling us that your heart is dying. And, and so they, you know, they rushed me into multiple emergencies. 

Joe Miller: Getting the enzymes that would indicate that.

Yep. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. And, uh, You know, they brought me in to, to do an emergency procedure to put a camera inside my heart to look at the blood vessels from, from inside, and, you know, they said, you know, you have a, a 1 in 200 percent chance of dying because of this operation, but your chance of dying is much higher if we don't do it, and like, my gosh, like, this is, this is real.

Wow. Wow. And, uh, and they did it, and, you know, They saw that, you know, it wasn't, wasn't a blockage, so no need for, you know, a stint or a new heart, new heart hardware or anything like that. It was just due to that swelling.

Joe Miller: Yeah, the flow was constricted. Yeah. Yeah, wow, that's crazy. And I do remember that period, you kind of faded away because you participated in, in, on the communities to help run it.

You kind of faded away and I touched base and you said I'm going through some stuff. I'll catch you later. And a couple months later, I'd say, are you still there? You go, I'm kind of here, but maybe give me another couple months. Cause this took a long period of time to work through for you. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, it was, it was about an eight month recovery and in the beginning it was, it was a really interesting psychological experience as well because I really didn't feel comfortable talking about it.

You know, it was kind of odd. I, I felt like it was, uh, something kind of shameful and I should, I should hide it. And, you know, uh, if people in the corporate world find out that I had a heart attack. They're not going to want to hire me again. And so it was kind of, kind of weird. And I also have other issues where it's hard for me to ask for help.

And I don't necessarily like to have, uh, 

Joe Miller: This sounds like the age old expression. The measure of a man is what stops him. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Joe Miller: So, yeah, that's a myth. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, you know, I don't, I don't, I didn't really like to show weakness, et cetera, et cetera. So, I, uh, I kept it kind of under wraps for a while.

But, uh, but I left, left Structure and really had this, this kind of big life decision to make. Which is, 

Joe Miller: really had to go back to zero. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Reassess some things. Yeah, so even though I'm, I'm young, too young to have a heart attack. Um, and no, no occlusions in my arteries. All of the doctors, which were, were many, said, now that you've had a heart attack, you are, you have to take these five drugs for the rest of your life, and you're exponentially more likely to have another heart attack in the future.

And the only thing you can do is regular checkups. You now need to see a cardiologist every six months for the rest of your life, and manage your risk factors. So, of course, there's diet and exercise, but also two of the, the silent killers are, are stress and sleep. And stress in, in corporate America is, is quite abundant.

And sleep is often one of the things that gets sacrificed when there are deliverables with tight timelines. And then of course, on top of that, your diet and exercise also often get sacrificed, right? You don't have time to cook meals, so you go out to eat more often, and you're too busy to go to the gym.

So it was, it was a question, you know, do I, do I roll the dice and go back into a, another in house corporate job? Do I completely leave corporate America and follow one of my passions? And one of my biggest passions is, uh, is mountain biking. So I was thinking about, like, do I open up a mountain biking rental company or a mountain biking tour company?

Do I open a, just a mountain biking store where, you know, we do maintenance and, and sell bikes? Or do I do something in between? Do I start my own company supporting the pharmaceutical industry? But, but make sure I prioritize the, the life and, and work life balance. And that was a, that was a really tough question that I struggled with for, for months.

It was a, it was a really long process that involved a lot of conversations with different people that I, uh, that I kind of valued their input. The main one being my, my girlfriend and, and my family, but then also some of the, the people in my network I consider mentors. 

Joe Miller: So then you went off and. Now, you are in a consulting organization.

Is that the organization you started or is? 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yep. So I, um, I decided to, to go into consulting and, uh, a big driver of that was being able to work part time. So the, the role that I, Uh, picked up through my network was, uh, you know, it was about five hours a week. Uh, over the next three to six months, it kind of turned into 10 hours a week.

Um, and then that is when I decided, you know, I like this idea. I think I'm gonna, I'll start my own company. Um, and, and just see how it goes. And a big driver of the company was, was being able to, to have kind of an entity to catch, to catch these things, no matter what I do, if I'm doing consulting or if I decide to, to write more books or, or whatever that might be.

And over the next six months, had conversations with, uh, with three people in my network that I really consider partners and said, you know, would you be interested in starting a consulting firm? That's really like a partnership with the four of us. And, and so it was Susan Hannon, who was my boss when I was at Zogenix.

Christy Pascovich, who worked with me at BioMarin and then who I hired at Zogenix. And Christy is, is really great with corporate communications. Susan is really great with doing culture and, uh, in board work, executive team development. And then a guy named Krishna Venigondla. who I also work with at BioMarin and then hired at Zogenix.

And Krishna is on the IT side and he recently moved to India, which was kind of a perfect combination that he could manage our team of offshore resources. So the four of us partnered up together and have the ability to do a little bit of everything. whether it's HR or, or it. And, uh, and so I became the managing partner.

So I'm the one who manages all of the, all of the accounting, all of the insurance, all of the websites, all of the marketing and everyone else is available for consulting gigs as, as they come up. And also they're all thought partners on the other books. 

Joe Miller: You basically designed something that has the right balance for you.

Um, it has the focus of what you want to do. So you've now completed like the fourth Chaco book, right? 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Yeah. So I, um, I just published the, the fourth book and now have kind of created a series and a website for the books and, and I'm working on two more. So that'll be, there'll be. At least six in the series, but I'm, I'm going to hold off publishing the sixth one, which it will be Choco Retires until I'm, I'm actually ready to kind of close that chapter.

Joe Miller: And now when you and I talked before, uh, this session, you told me that you actually were You've had a couple writing projects that are in the adult category, uh, around leadership. And so did you say that you're actually working on something that would be coming out soon next year? 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, that's early next year plan.

Um, really. I have loved the process of writing the Chaco books and in, um, in that process felt like there was a natural progression to write something more aligned with my consulting firm. And so I wanted to write a book that could essentially be used as a platform for my consulting services. So my consulting services can help sell the book and my book can help sell the consulting services.

And Together, we can partner with companies to go through the content that's in the book and build, build customized content for, for companies based on kind of what, what their unique circumstances are. And so in, uh, in, uh, kind of early Q2, I caught the bug for writing this book. I was, I was going to sleep, you know, it's like 10 PM at night, my head's on the pillow and this idea just like shot into my head.

I was like, you need to write a book about corporate leadership. And my brain was just firing at a million miles an hour. And I got all of these ideas for the structure of the book, some of the overall themes of the book, the concepts that I wanted to make sure were in the book, and the characters that I wanted to make sure were represented in the book.

I didn't go to sleep, fall asleep until like 2 a. m. That morning. 

Joe Miller: Um, didn't we just talk about sleep? 

Mike Peterson: Yes, we did. I just, okay. Yeah, it's so true, but it was, it was just one of those. I don't know if you ever had that happen, but it's. It's only happened a few times in my life, but, uh, but sometimes, you know, the inspiration calls and you just have to, you have to embrace it.

And it was kind of too good to, to pass up. So I was just letting the ideas flow. And I woke up at, uh, at like 6am the next day and immediately, like before coffee or anything, went straight to my computer and typed all of these ideas onto paper. And, uh, and the idea was born. And, um, the reality is, the adult book is much more complicated to write.

Joe Miller: So you just knew intuitively that you needed to get some miles in on your children's books. 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, exactly. You know, the first Chaco book took me, uh, I estimate about 400 hours to publish of my time. And then of course there's other people's times on top of that. And my most recent Chaco book, that I published was, was probably more close to about 40 hours of my time.

So, so I was able to shorten the amount of time by essentially tenfold. Now there's still, it's still about a three month process because there's a lot of back and forth with illustrators and editors, and then I have to go through the publishing process, which can take a lot of time ordering, um, uh, you know, ordering draft copies and printing setup and all that kind of stuff.

But it's still only 40 hours and, and this new book, which I'm calling Beyond the Title, is Sorry, to back up a second, a Chaco book is about 32 pages, and uh, and each page is only about a sentence. You know, it's about, it's about 32 sentences long. 

Joe Miller: A lot of illustrations going to page. 

Mike Peterson: Yes, exactly. Yeah, so they're, they're picture books, so it's, it's all, you know, full page, uh, full page spreads.

Where beyond the title is, is 40, 000 words, so it's, uh, it's about 250 pages long and, uh, and has, has taken a lot of, lot of thought and in collaboration with other people to make sure the ideas are refined and can actually stand up when, when you, you know, when you're a reader absorbing these concepts through the book and then trying to apply those concepts.

So, again, it's been a super, super fun process. It's probably taken, uh, a thousand hours of work so far. It really has turned into a full time job in its own. I've become addicted to really getting this book out, and I'm in the final stretches, so I should get the edits back from my editor on version 7 in early January.

I'm going through the process of redesigning the cover based on, uh, feedback from a few of my colleagues and, and other editors, and we'll hope to have it published in, in late January. Wow, that's exciting. Yeah, yeah. That's really exciting. I'm very, very excited about it. 

Joe Miller: Well, we'll definitely put in the show notes, put information in regarding all your books and where to find them and how to.

How to reach you. But I think at this point, I'd like to pivot and kind of looking back over the arc of the very interesting career that you have had and those transitions you've had and ask you some, some questions. I mean, one cluster of questions, or maybe a cluster of answers comes out of one question.

It's what lessons Do you think we're learn through all these transitions that might be, you know, principled lessons that people can take away as they're thinking that there might be something inside them telling them it's time for them to take, take a shift in direction? 

Mike Peterson: Yeah, those are, those are great questions.

And I think, I think there's a, a few, few lessons that I've learned. really taken away from my experiences. It sounds a little cliche, but it's one of the lessons I've learned most recently, which is what you do is less important than how much fun you're having while you do it. And a big factor, at least for me, on how much fun I'm having is who I'm doing my work with and the people that I'm.

You know, your, your work colleagues are, are people that we spend sometimes more time with than our own families. And it's so important to make sure that those people are people that you enjoy spending time with. In, in my consulting practice, I've really surrounded myself with people. with people I love spending time with, and never in a million years did I imagine I would be doing the things I'm doing, but I, I have been having so much fun, and I feel so much fulfillment in this process of, of really, um, kind of pursuing happiness in, in my career, where, where previously, um, it has always been.

Doing the rat race, running in the wheel as fast as you can, climbing the ladder as fast as you can. My idea was to be a CEO as quickly as possible. And, um, and so it sounds cliche to, to really follow your, your dreams and follow your, your passions and do what makes you happy. You know, I, I don't know about you, but I, I've been kind of hearing this my whole life from, you know, teachers and professors and, you know, Uh, career counselors, but I'm just now realizing that, man, it's actually true.

I think the other one is to make sure that whatever you're doing, you're always learning. And that has been big for me personally and also big for me leading HR and IT at public organizations is to really instill a culture of learning, you know, even if we're an expert in something, it doesn't mean that we stop learning.

We don't want to sit back and be idle and essentially atrophy, you know, learning takes conscious effort and it's really important to, to make sure that's embraced in your own personal story with whatever you're doing. there's always opportunities to grow. And that ties in really, really nicely to my, my, my third lesson, which I, which I heard from an old mentor of mine, Dan Mayer, back at BioMarin.

Dan is now retired. He was the head of product management, portfolio development, one of, one of those two titles at, at BioMarin when I joined. And I think he's one of the, uh, not necessarily a founder, but he was one of the first kind of 10 to 20 employees. And, um, I used to run the intern program at BioMarin, and, and Dan always loved giving back to the community.

Uh, and so he played a really active role in the intern program, even though he was a, you know, C suite executive at a multi billion dollar company. So I, I worked very closely with him. And, um, he said very early on in my career, which I'm very grateful for, that you need to ride the wave. And so you can think of this wave in your career as you step onto the wave, you're at the bottom, and you start learning and building skills, and the wave starts to crest, and you're at the peak of the wave, and at some point, that wave is gonna crash and smooth out over the sand on the beach, and you want to make sure that you're That by the time the wave you're on peaks, you step off to the next wave and ride that wave even higher.

And, and I've been living my entire career based on that advice. You know, when I, when I feel like I'm not learning something, I take a step laterally and ride the next wave to teach myself something new. And it's been, uh, a really fantastic process. 

Joe Miller: Wow. I really like that one. It's so much more sophisticated than similar advice.

I used to give it, uh, for people who weren't satisfied in their career, kind of looking at it like a game of Donkey Kong. Remember the ladders? Yes. Yeah. Jumping the ladders. But that one, I like riding the wave a lot better. That sounds a whole lot better to me. That was really great advice. Um, but thank you so much for that, Mike.

As we Kind of wrap it up now. What I would like you to do is just give everyone listening some guidance on how to find you, how to find your content and what we should, uh, I guess what we should be looking out for us by standard question. You've already. Tipped your hand on another book coming. Yeah.

Where are you? And where can people reach you? 

Mike Peterson: Yeah. Uh, thanks, Joe. I'm, I'm primarily on LinkedIn. I've been doing a lot of content and posts on, on LinkedIn and I have two websites Apex Consulting dot Partners for the consulting firm and Chaco's Adventures for the children's books. I, uh, uh, am published through Amazon KDP.

So the only place you can find my books is on Amazon. Although that might change in the future. Who knows? And I plan on publishing Beyond the Title, Real Leadership in the Digital Age, in the next month or two. 

Joe Miller: And just a quick question on that one, because of course our background, shared background on Beyond the Title.

Obviously the book will come first, but is this something that may become part of what your consulting organization then would offer? 

Mike Peterson: Yes. Yeah, absolutely. So the, the book is really a, an opportunity to buy a toolkit, so to speak. So the book is a standalone product, but we'll also have a significant amount of resources that will be available online.

Once you, once you buy the book, there'll be a QR code to use that'll let you in. Uh, to the tools and resources on the website. And then if you want more of a hands on experience of implementing this in your organization, no matter what that is, uh, you can hire Apex Consulting Group to help you really, yeah, engage more and develop it for your organization.

Joe Miller: Mike, this has been wonderful. Again, thanks again for being on Titans of Transition. Certainly had some vast swings in your career and some, some great insights. Yeah. Um, heartfelt thanks to you, buddy. Thank you so much for having me, Joe. I really appreciate it. Thanks for joining me today on Titans of Transition.

I hope you enjoyed the episode. Please check the show notes for additional information.